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Regular Meeting November 12, 2002 Charlton Town Board Saratoga County New York
After the pledge to the flag the invocation was given by Town Clerk Gail Hanchar.
At the regular meeting of the Town Board of Charlton, Saratoga County, New York held at
Councilman Alan Grattidge
Motion made by Councilman Schroeder, seconded by Councilman Grattidge that the minutes of the October 15, 2002 Town Board Meeting, the October 28, 2002 Public Hearing and Agenda Meeting and the October 30, 2002 Special Meeting be accepted as received. PASSED UNANIMOUSLY.
ABSTRACT OF CLAIMS:
General Fund: Abstract of Claims totaling $24,921.40. Motion made by Councilman Schroeder, seconded by Councilman Grattidge.
Highway Fund: Abstract of Claims totaling $13,696.07. Motion made by
Water Fund: Abstract of Claims totaling $902.33. Motion made by Councilman Schroeder, seconded by Councilman Grattidge. PASSED UNANIMOUSLY.
Vouchers for the month were #1015-#1126.
TOWN CLERK'S REPORT:
Gail Hanchar read the Town Clerk's Report. She reported taking in $146.90. Motion made by Councilman Schroeder, seconded by Councilman Grattidge. PASSED UNANIMOUSLY.
PRIVILEGE OF THE FLOOR (Agenda Items):
Lorraine Barney, Project Manager and Tom Picciott, Gas Engineer Manager, were present from Niagara Mohawk to explain and answer questions regarding the gas pipeline project that will run through a portion of Charlton, terminating in the area of Valentine Road. Lorraine handed out a fact sheet to everyone present explaining the project, the impacts on Charlton and the regulatory approval process.
THE PROJECT: Lorraine explained that in March of last year there was an announcement that Niagara Mohawk planned on building a pipeline and an application was filed with the Public Service Commission. Since then, Niagara Mohawk has been going through the regulatory process and meeting with the different towns that would be involved to inform them of the project, let them know what impact it would have on their community and to get input and feedback before they went to construction. Construction will begin next year. It is a gas transmission pipeline. It parallels an existing transmission pipeline. Most of the gas from the pipeline delivery system is south of the Thruway. There is an existing station in Rotterdam. The new pipeline will be built north from the Rotterdam station, to the Town of Glenville and into Charlton. In Charlton, it will tie back into the existing pipeline. NIMO will reinforce the system and provide deliveries to the north country where they are experiencing considerable growth. There are constraints on the system the way it is now and it is unable to handle growth. This reinforcement will provide for growth for the next 10 years.
IMPACTS ON CHARLTON: The gas line will enter Saratoga County, cross Crooked Street, the Alplauskill, Old Stage Road, Stage Road and terminate approximately 2,500 feet north of Stage Road. This pipeline will run at the same pressure as the existing pipeline, 465 pounds. They are building it to a 900-pound capacity but initially it will operate at 465 pounds. We started out with a tie-in station site just north of Charvale Pool. After an initial review last May, there were some objections because of agricultural fields. Another site was found closer to Stage Road. It was pursued until there were objections from neighbors, landowners and the Town due to visual impacts and safety impacts. NIMO asked the Public Service Commission for an extension to review the two sites and anything in between to see if there was a better location that would be more acceptable. They reviewed the pool site. DEC and Agriculture and Markets agreed to use that site as long as there were no above ground structures in the agricultural field and special construction techniques would be used to get through the Alplauskill and a wetland. On
Joe Schaus - Stage Road - Spoke regarding questions and concerns in an email sent to Lorraine on November 7, 2002. The following questions were addressed:
1. The expected dBA at the fence enclosure boundary and the expected dBA at 400 feet from the area fence enclosure boundary.
Lorraine stated that gas moving in the pipe will create some noise but everything will be underground. She said the noise would not be heard at the fence enclosure boundary. Lorraine said the two pipes will be running at the same pressure. There won't be a pressure cut when you tie the two pipes together. When the pressure is raised on the new line and regulators are put in, they will be underground. The controls will have cabinets over them. Legally that keeps the noise to a minimum. We have a station north of here where the pipeline that we are tying into terminates. There was some noise measurement taken. Before we did any other mitigation to minimize the noise, it was measured at 90 decibels at the regulator. A study said that at 400 feet away, it would diminish by 49 decibels.
Joe Schaus asked that if the valves were unprotected or unhoused it would be 90 decibels? Lorraine said that was correct. She said these valves would be underground and that would minimize the noise. The station in Charlton will have above ground piping for an internal inspection. A "pig" will be launched through the line. We don't expect a noise issue at all. 40 decibels would be the hum of a refrigerator in your home. 50 decibels would be a dishwasher. If noise is an issue there are things that NIMO could do to mitigate it. Joe stated that according to the current zoning, there are no noise levels for any industrial operations in Charlton. A lot of communities do have noise levels for certain distances from some operations.
2. Plan and elevation views.
Joe is also concerned about plan an elevation views. Lorraine showed photos of the area that they will be working in. There would be two cabinets that would house the regulators and above ground pipe for the "pig". The fence will be 7" feet with barbed wire at the top. Joe asked if they would be using the existing Charvale Pool driveway as an access road to get into the site? NIMO has to meet with Charvale Pool to discuss this. They could use the access off Valentine Road. The access during construction will be along the right-of-way. Lorraine said the project will probably start in Rotterdam. Joe suggested that if something is worked out with Charvale Pool, as a good will gesture, NIMO could pave their parking lot. Lorraine stated that it was not out of the realm of possibility.
3. Safety risk assessment.
Joe expressed concern about safety risks such as a terrorist attack, lightning or a tree fall, down power lines, an explosion due to a valve or instrumentation leak or a pipe failure or a motor vehicle collision with surface equipment.
Tom Picciott, Gas Engineering Manager for NIMO, spoke regarding safety precautions. The gas line that is currently in Charlton did have lightning hit it once and it also suffered a rupture about five years ago. As a result of those things, NIMO fully instrumented that line which included float control, pressure monitoring and flow monitoring at several stations so NIMO could more accurately determine what was going on with the system so that in case of an emergency they could rapidly shut it down. The existing line has a remote shut-off valve on Old Stage Road. It can be shut down from their control room in Syracuse. The new line will have similar devices on it. It will be a ten-mile line. We become concerned when we have a rupture and have to isolate it because gas service is shut off to customers. We want to minimize the distance between the valves so they don't affect as many customers. The new pipeline has no taps off it. It starts in Scotia and terminates when it goes back into the old pipe. There will be instrumentation at either end with a shut-off at the inlet and the outlet.
As far as terrorism, NIMO is at a high state of alert. The Public Service Commission is demanding of NIMO that they stay at a high state of alert and take extra precautions. The pipe will be positioned in such a way as to deter terrorist attacks and every precaution is being taken to protect against attacks.
The pipes are designed to protect against lightning and also placed in the ground and grounded. A tree fall can't hurt any below ground equipment.
To protect from a car collision, NYS code requires a fifty-foot spacing from the regulators and isolation valves. Joe asked if there were any gas monitoring lines in the control cabinets? Tom said they were small instrumentation lines.
4. Projected disruptions, discharges and noise for any planned testing and future maintenance, including time schedule and frequency.
Construction would normally consist of six ten-hour days. We can deviate from that upon request. We can get special dispensation from the Public Service Commission and the agencies that handle control of our permits.
We typically don't blow down the line after it is in service. We use a monitor and control set. Rather than putting a relief valve in, we put in two regulators in series so if one regulator fails, the other one picks up. We also have full monitoring capabilities back to the control room so they can watch it and react if something does go awry. You shouldn't get any noise from that. The times you will get some noise is when they send an Instrumented Inline Inspection Device ("pig") down the line. We will be sending sponge pics down the pipe to dry the pipe. At the end of the project, we will put a hydro-test on the pipe to ensure the integrity of the system. At that time we will have the pressure in the pipes to 11/2 times its maximum operating pressure. The maximum operating pressure of this line is 900 pounds. We will also send "brush pigs" through the line to clean the inside of the pipe. After that we send the "pig" through the pipe to measure every square inch of the wall of the pipe looking for defects. Five or ten years later we will send another "pig" down the line. The noise you will get won't be that much noise.
Resident -If you don't pass the hydro test and the pipe is buried, how do you find the leak? Tom replied that they would have to look for the leak by finding water above ground. The integrity of the welds is checked by a radiograph. The pipe is checked by the hydro test.
Tom stated that by putting ten miles of pipe in now, it would solve the load growth for the next ten years but NIMO's intent is to continue to build if the load growth dictates that they should. They would continue to parallel the existing line. The tie in point with regulators could be a source of nuisance and problems. We would probably not use the station in Charlton but build a station further north and use that one. Going back to noise, 90 decibels is pretty loud close up. If noise should become objectionable at some point in the future due to something unexpected, we have been very successful in putting insulation in. We intend to run both pipes at the same pressure initially. When we say initially, that is for the next ten years. You shouldn't hear any noise whatsoever for the next ten years. It would be ten years before we would put the regulators in, five years, if we experience super load growth in New York State, particularly in the Saratoga area or in the eastern part of the state. Things could change more rapidly than we predict but initially you won't hear any noise.
Councilman Schroeder - This pipe won't serve any Charlton residents.
Supervisor Acunto - What does 90 decibels equate to? A lawn mower running?
Lorraine - Outdoors at 85 decibels would be a truck at 100 feet. A lawn mower at 100 feet is 70 decibels.
Supervisor Acunto - If there is a concern from residents regarding noise, do they go directly to Niagara Mohawk or do they go to the Public Service Commission?
Tom - Usually the Zoning Officer would call us and we would take care of it.
Jim Crawford - Valentine Road - Thanked NIMO for listening to their complaints regarding the placement of the line and gave appreciation for the changes they have made.
Councilman Grattidge asked if this would be coming before the Planning Board for review once NIMO gets their final approval?
Lorraine stated that the Public Service Commission is the lead agency and any concerns would go through the PSC.
Dave Morrell - Case Annalist for Public Service Commission - They would require NIMO to coordinate with the town on all site plan reviews before they approve anything.
Supervisor Acunto stated that we did hear NIMO stipulate that they would mitigate any concerns that might arise after installation. Dave said that if it goes beyond the company, the PSC is the final stop for any complaints.
Ann Booth stated that some years ago the Charlton School for Girls hooked up to a gas line. When they were finishing it off they said that if we wanted they could extend it. Ann heard nothing from the town board trying to get other people who might be interested because the more people you have the cheaper it is.
Tom said he would look at it and see what it would take. Lorraine believes some portion of the town was surveyed some years ago. Supervisor Acunto asked how residents could get a survey done again? Tom said NIMO could look at different areas the town would like surveyed. There is a definite criterion that needs to be met to extend lines.
Andy LaPatra thanked the board for helping and supporting him.
Joe Marchesiello - Crooked Street - Asked where the subdivision on Crooked Street stands? The Town Board was going to speak to the Planning Board. Where does the subdivision lie as far as jurisdiction? Does it go back to the Planning Board or does it lie with the Town Board?
Supervisor Acunto - The developer's attorney has presented through the town attorney a proposed water extension petition which now deals with the establishment of a public hearing at some time. Nothing can be done as far as extending that date. The Town Board will meet with Mr. Tabner to review the draft escrow agreement that has been written. There are some issues that have to be resolved. Mr. Tabner will have to go back to the developer to clarify some issues in the agreement. If the Board is comfortable with the escrow agreement and it gets signed, the next issue is that the developer will have to come up with "x" number of dollars. At that time a public hearing will be held. We had a Special Town Board Meeting in executive session on
October 30. As a result of that meeting, we were going to ask the attorneys and engineers of both sides to discuss issues and see if they can clarify some of the major concerns. After that, we will ask the Planning Board to step in.
Joe asked if the minutes of the Special Board Meeting will be on the web? Supervisor Acunto stated the minutes are very brief and read them. No minutes are taken in executive session. Supervisor Acunto said that if any information came up he would give Joe a call.
SUPERVISOR'S REPORT:
October review of revenue and expenditures:
Major expenditures:
Major revenue:
The Town Hall will be closed November 28 - 30 for the Thanksgiving holiday.
Ron offered one of our trucks to the Town of Wilton if they need it for an emergency.
Board actions taken at the Agenda Meeting:
Marv reported that DEC has sole authority regarding spraying unless the county has opted into the notification enforcement part of the program, which they have not. In no case would authority relegate down to the town level. There is a general exemption for farm spraying from all regulations. There are general words in the DEC regulations about making sure that the wind is not blowing in the direction of any residence. DEC said that as far as there being a buffer zone, that doesn't work because primarily there is a general farm exemption. As far as the notification law that says you are supposed to notify residential owners if you are going to be spraying, that deals with commercial sprayers and farmers as well. If license permitted sprayers were required to do that sort of thing, they would have to meet the normal requirements of the licensing.
Supervisor Acunto asked that if spraying is going on and Joe is feeling an impact, his recourse is to call DEC? Marv said DEC suggested that it comes down to the good faith of the people spraying, assuming it was a farmer doing to spraying. If it was a licensed sprayer, then you could go to the DEC. If there was a flagrant violation, a complaint from DEC would be in order.
Marv also said that DEC stated that the insecticide or pesticide that the farmer is spraying is expensive. The farmer doesn't want to waste it Joe asked about the long-term effects on the soil, the permeability of the soil and ground water contamination, as there is no public water supply to his property. The property on which the chemical is being applied provides a water shed for Joe's property. In the spring, all the run off runs into his yard. Brian Premo from DEC explained to Marv that except for a very few special use pesticides or insecticides, most break down pretty rapidly. It doesn't take a lot of soil to purify it. DEC does not worry about that in respect to water tables unless you are actually spraying right into water. Joe said he does not buy what DEC is saying and he will continue to pursue it.
Councilman Grattidge asked if there was any communication with Mr. Buhrmaster over the summer. Joe said there was communication with Mr. Buhrmaster, Kerby Loukes and Ruth Loukes. They were not willing to negotiate.
Marv said that there are new Storm Management Regulations that involve runoff from the top of the soil into water courses. Fertilizers, sprays, pesticides, etc. getting washed into streams is an ongoing problem. EPA has new regulations which Marv will report on later.
Joe said that when they purchased the property, rye grass was being grown there. Had they known that products would be grown there with application as it is now, they would not have purchased the property. Joe feels that if he were to sell his property now, he probably would not get what it is worth or they would have a hard time selling it. Marv said that he spoke with Mr. Buhrmaster and this might have been a one-time deal. Joe said that Mr. Buhrmaster has invested a lot in that field, has built a pond without a permit and hoses used in the field are at the edge of the woods. He believes they will use the field next year.
COMMUNICATIONS:
Supervisor Acunto read a note from the Serepilios on Charlton Road thanking the town and the Highway Superintendent for quick action in having some trees taken down in Gideon Hawley Park which were leaning toward their property and over power lines.
Supervisor Acunto read a note from Paul and Nadine Tyler for the Hazardous Waste Collection.
Supervisor Acunto reported that NIMO has asked the Public Service Commission to extend the period for a decision on the gas line permit. NIMO has been painting the shelters on Cherry, Crawford, Redwood, Komar and Imperial Lane for underground service. All shelters were painted except #3 on Imperial Lane because the brush was too close. John Morgan will talk to the homeowner.
We will need an executive session to discuss the permit and agreement regarding the subdivision on Crooked Street. Mr. Tabner will be attending an executive session on November 25 to give us further information as to how to proceed. We have some litigation and a personnel matter for tonight.
We received a letter from the Association of Towns regarding dues and the Annual Meeting in New York City. We will pass a resolution appointing a voting delegate to the meeting.
We will be adopting the budget for 2003 with a recommendation for an amendment.
CONSTABLES:
Supervisor Acunto is working on the breathalyzer situation with Tom Parks and the City of Mechanicville.
ENVIRONMENTAL CONSERVATION COMMISSION:
They have started to evaluate the new EPA Storm Water Management Regulations. At the local level it looks like it will require some sort of management plan. It looks like either a new ordinance or zoning ordinance changes might be required. They will be writing an educational article for the Newsletter. Marv has brought this to the attention of the Zoning Ordinance Review Committee.
HIGHWAY:
Ron is working on the specifications for the new truck. Bids have been picked-up and mailed.
HISTORIAN:
Laura has been working with the Historic District Commission and the Records Advisory Board this month.
HISTORIC DISTRICT COMMISSION:
Doris reported that the Commission had held two meetings. One meeting was on October 22 and one on November 6. The meeting on October 22 was basically for the members of the Commission and the steering committee. The firm that is working on improvements to the Historic District is LandWorks of Middlebury, Vermont. When the proposal is done they will be pursuing grants. Doris believes that the person who is helping them with grants for the Historic District would also be of help to the town in obtaining grants for the new town hall. Landworks is also working with the Historic District to possibly get the Gideon Hawley Park into the town hall landscape. Supervisor Acunto said he had done some research on the issue of lighting for the Historic District. The law is very specific. They will be having another meeting before the end of the year.
PLANNING BOARD:
They will be meeting on November 18.
RECORDS ADVISORY BOARD:
The Board will be meeting next Wednesday at 7:30 P.M. at the Town Hall. We will be reviewing the records that were in question. Anyone is welcome to come. NYS Archives will be sponsoring a grant-writing workshop here at the Town Hall tomorrow from
WATER DISTRICT:
John is winterizing the hydrants.
LIBRARY:
The will be a meeting of the Burnt Hills Ballston Lake Library on November 27.
ZONING:
We are still looking for an Assistant Zoning Administrator.
ZONING ORDINANCE REVIEW COMMITTEE:
They have started by putting together a list of potential changes. Marv has suggested that the members of the committee consider what works well and what doesn't work well. There will be another meeting the beginning of December. The Committee will be looking at the new Storm Water Management Regulations.
RESOLUTIONS:
Before a vote on the 2003 Town Budget, Supervisor Acunto explained that the budget represents a .95% increase from last year. There will be no town tax for the 21st year.
Motion made by Councilman Grattidge, seconded by Councilman Lippiello that
Supervisor Acunto explained that he had gotten a call from Judge Ketchum regarding increasing the Court Clerk's hours. The Court Clerk submitted a letter outlining her duties. Supervisor Acunto recommended that we amend the budget to increase her salary to $5,200.00. With the increase, there would be an increase in her hours from 20 hours per month to 40 hours per month.
Motion made by Councilman Schroeder, seconded by Councilman Grattidge that
Approved: Councilman Grattidge Yes
Motion made by Councilman Grattidge, seconded by Councilman Lippiello that
Approved: Councilman Grattidge Yes
Motion made by Councilman Schroeder, seconded by Councilman Grattidge that
Approved: Councilman Grattidge Yes
COUNCILMAN REPORTS:
Councilman Lippiello - He is pleased to see the progress being made in the hamlet.
Councilman Schroeder - Announced that there is a boy scout present, David Kinns, from
Supervisor Acunto said that in March, the Town of Charlton will be honoring Dick LeGere as a deceased veteran at the county. He will let everyone know when that presentation will take place.
Councilman Grattidge - He is impressed with the work being done on the main street plans. He hopes for input from the people in the Historic District and from other people in the town.
Councilman Mitchell - The Historic District Commission has enjoyed working with LandWorks. Things are moving along very well.
Motion made by Councilman Mitchell, seconded by Councilman Lippiello, A Motion to adjourn to an executive session following the Town Board meeting to discuss a personnel issue and litigation, be approved:
Approved: Councilman Grattidge Yes
PRIVILEGE OF THE FLOOR:
Walt Schmidt - Sacandaga Road - He is impressed with the improvements that are being considered for Charlton Road in the hamlet. Regarding the new town hall, Walt feels this is the worse design for a town hall that he has ever seen. He feels it doesn't work. It needs tremendous review. He feels there are many, many flaws in the design and utilization of the building. Walt feels the money is very poorly invested in the current design. We should get people from the town involved before we get too far along.
Sandy Verola - Redwood Drive - She agrees with Walt that there should be a citizen's group looking at the town hall.
Walt asked if we are $10,000.00 down the road in design already? Supervisor Acunto said he would have to pull the bill. Walt said what we have is a CAD drawing. What do we have for our money? Councilman Grattidge stated that we had workshop sessions with a needs study. Walt is especially concerned about the roof design. He sees no flexibility in the building. To make any changes the footprint would have to be increased. It is hard to make a opinion on the CAD drawing when you don't know what the walls are constructed of, what the footings look like, what the bearing is, what the snow loads are, etc. Sandy stated we have a lot of really talented people in town. Sandy suggested that while the town board is in executive session tonight they could discuss appointing a citizens committee to go over the design and work with the architect. Supervisor Acunto said that the architect will be here at the end of the agenda meeting on November 25. Anyone is welcome to come and voice any concerns.
Sandy asked if this project would come before the public for a vote. Supervisor Acunto said there is a reserve of money in a Building Reserve Fund. To free that money out of the reserve requires a public hearing. The Board will have a hearing and then make a decision to free it or not to free it. If there is a group of people that are not happy with the Board's decision, they can petition and make it a mandatory referendum.
Maggie Schmidt - Sacandaga Road - The center space for public meeting room in the new building is not any larger than the room we have now. She does not believe that is big enough.
Ann Booth - Lake Hill Road - Feels there is not enough coverage in the paper. Supervisor Acunto said that the agenda for each meeting is faxed to The Gazette. Steve Williams has been unable to attend our meetings and we are not getting the coverage we used to get. Marv Schorr feels that we need to improve our communication from the town board to the town's people as to what is going on.
Jim Leupold - Edwin Drive - Asked if anything more has been happening with the Water Study Committee? Supervisor Acunto said that the last time it was voted on it did not pass. The board is still discussing it. Jim asked that if the meetings of the Water Study Committee would be public meetings? Supervisor Acunto said they would have to be public meetings. They cannot be held in executive session.
After everyone had the opportunity to speak who wished, the meeting was adjourned to an executive session at 9:40 P.M.
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